No one ever said it was an international holiday... However, nothing is stopping you from celebrating it twice due to the joys of non-standard calindrical formatting.

Making Scalzi's Schadenfreude Pie here tonight!

Baking things for people you like is an unalloyed good.

Because I'm pretty sure "enjoy some nice free pie with your coffee" would not be the result....

I'm going to be making a pumpkin pie in a pre-made graham shell, and hoping the thing doesn't turn a horrible crispy brown at the edges during the baking. Pray for me.

Round here meat pies are the unmarked default. We have fruit pies but "Who ate all the pies?" makes you think of steak and kidney.

And our local food speciality is pie & mash. And jellied eels.

French-Canadian Pork Pie

Ingredients:

Pie crust sufficient for a two-crust pie (I used pre-made, but if you've got a light hand for pastry and the patience to go with it, you could make your own. Sources I've read say that for the ultra-traditional, a lard-based pastry is the way to go; I've never bothered.)

Filling:
2 large yellow onions, chopped fine (I ran mine through the food processor)
1.5 pounds ground pork
3 medium-to-large white potatoes, cooked (you could boil them; I steamed them in the microwave) and coarsely mashed
1 cup beef stock (I used stock base from a jar and made it up double strength)
1 egg, beaten
1/2 teaspoon allspice
1/4 teaspoon ground cloves
1/4 teaspoon thyme
dash of nutmeg
dash of cinnamon
two or three grindings of black pepper
(the stock was sufficiently salty that I didn't bother with adding more salt.)

Cook the ground pork and the chopped onions together in a frying pan until the pork isn't pink any longer. Drain off the fat.

Add the pork and onion mixture to the mashed cooked potatoes and mix them up. Then add the beef stock, the beaten egg, and the spices, and mix them up some more.

Have your pie pan ready with the bottom crust in place. Put in the filling. Put on the top crust, and crimp it down. Cut slits in the top to facilitate the escape of steam. (At this point, I suppose one could do one or another of the various things one does with egg or milk to put a glaze onto the crust; again, I didn't bother.)

Bake in a 375 degree oven for 20 minutes, then turn the heat down to 350 and bake 45 minutes more. (It's probably a good idea to put a foil-lined baking sheet on the rack below, in case of spillover.)

When it's done, remove from the oven, let cool for 10-15 minutes, then serve.

1 egg
a handful of fresh herbs
Copious black pepper

1 can corned beef
3 large white potatatatoes, cooked

2 packages puff pastry sheets

Blend the onion, egg, & herbs. Mash into the potatoes and corned beef. Roll pastry around half-inch strips of filling, slice into pieces 1-1.5in long. Bake in a hot oven for about 10 minutes (until it be enough), or freeze and bake frozen.

The idea is you make a huge batch before some celebration, serve maybe half of them, and then freeze the rest to be baked in little batches as the need arises over the next week or so.

Replacing the corned beef with a coarsely-chopped version of pesto works for vegetarians.

Authentic, Shmauthentic. Every Mamère has her favourite recipe, handed down. Yours looks perfectly authentic to me.

I'm allergic to pork, so this is one of those things I can't eat. I just have to smell it and yearn.

I may try it this weekend.

If you like lamb (which I do but my family, sadly, does not) you might sub that in for the pork and alter the spicing to taste. Just sayin.

I'll eat lamb (though I did go off it the summer I worked at a sheep farm).

I've had kosher meat pies*, and they are very good. They just don't smell the same as my grandmother's tourtière.

*when you're allergic to pork, kosher butchers are your friend.

If I need to adapt a pork recipe for people who don't eat swine, I use duck. The duck fat can also substitute for pork lard. It's not even that expensive if you buy whole ducks, although not as cheap as pork. [Goose would work, but they're very expensive here in Toronto.]

One way of doing it is to cut the breasts and legs from the duck and use them in the pork recipe [or freeze for later use, or make confit with the legs], and take the rest of the carcass and any skin or fat, and put it in a slow-cooker with water to cover, and simmer it until the cartilage dissolves. After you strain and chill it, you will have tasty duck stock, and plenty of duck fat to cook with.

I've priced rendered duck fat, and it costs about the same as buying a whole duck and rendering it, with bonus duck meat. I.e., you might get a pint of fat from one duck, and the whole duck costs the same as just buying the fat. If you are lucky, the liver will be included with the duck.

Duck prosciutto is a traditional Northern Italian Jewish thing, but I haven't tried making it yet. It has got to be awesome! I've had Hungarian-style smoked goose and that was delicious. Duck, either confit or fresh is great in choucroute garni, cassoulet, etc.

"More hot pies! More hot, more pies!"

Catherine @28: I remember Simon the Pieman fondly, sorry to hear they've closed up shop. There are a few meat pie vendors in the US, in particular one in Buffalo, which I've considered ordering from.

A search with Google turned up a pie maker in New England, but as I recall their fillings were more akin to pizza toppings than tradition: steak and cheese, chicken "pahm," and so forth. Seems likely to produce a Sub standard meat pie, not a traditional one.

I'm reluctant because an English meat pie seems like the sort of foodstuff that would be particularly ill-served by techniques of production in mass quantities. The folks in Buffalo might still be competitive with or better than a Sainsbury's or Tesco's meat pie -- I can't imagine the Buffalonians produce in quantities suited to British supermarkets, but they are also clearly not producing at the quantities of the neighbourhood pie shop down the road, next to the barber's.

Also, no duck and apricot pie from the place in Buffalo

Margo Oliver's Pork Pie

3 lbs shoulder of pork
1 1/2 to 2 lb pig's feet
1 medium onion, sliced
1/4 t thyme
1 large bay leaf
3 whole cloves
2 t salt
6 peppercorns
boiling water
3/4 cu chopped onion
1/2 t sage
1 t salt
1/4 t pepper
2 T butter
1/2 cu water
1 egg yolk
1 T milk
1 recipe lard pastry

1. Remove all fat from pork shoulder and bone. Discard fat. Cut meat into 1 1/2 inch cubes and reserve.
2. Combine pork bones, pig's feet, sliced onion thyme, bay leaf, cloves, 2 t salt and peppercorns in kettle. Add boiling water to cover. Bring to a boil, turn down heat, cover and simmer for 3 hours.
3. Strain broth from pork bones and pig's feet. Remove lean meat and add to pork cubes. Discard bones. Chill broth and lift off fat. Boil broth until reduced to about 2 cups.
4. Heat oven to 325 degrees.
5. Roll 2/3 of lard pastry into a round big enough to line the bottom and sides of a 9-inch spring form pan, 3 inches deep. Ease it into pan and anchor it by pressing firmly against the sides of the pan.
6. Put cubes of raw pork and bits of cooked port into pastry-lined pan. Sprinkle with chopped onion, sage, 1 t salt and pepper. Dot with butter.
7. Roll remaining dough into a round a little larger than the top of the pan. Lay round over the meat, moisten under edge and seal upper and lower crusts by crimping firmly.
8. Cut a small round hole the size of a quarter in the center of the top crust. Pour in 1/2 cup water.
9. Bake about 4 hours or until crust is well browned. Brush top of crust with a mixture of egg yolk beaten with 1 T milk after baking 3 hours.
10. Remove pie from oven and pour as much heated broth as the pie will take through hole.
11. Chill for at least 12 hours. Serves 12.

Lard Pastry

2/3 cu boiling water
1 1/3 cu lard
4 cu all-purp flour
1 1/2 t salt

1. Add boiling water to lard and beat with wood spoon or beater until creamy. Cool. Stir in flour and salt, mixing with a fork. Gather into a ball, wrap in wax paper and chill until ready to use.

See Jane Grigson for other suggestions about raised pies and how to season them. She suggests, for example, some anchovy paste in pork pie. Good.

We never let the shade of Mrs. Lovett stop us. Long ago in Palo Alto there was a meat pie shop called, if memory serves, John Bull. We always called it "Mrs. Lovett's" and gleefully ate quantities of the things. (Great object to pick up for lunch on the way back to work from voice lesson.)

Or perhaps getting the faux-nail means your are Barber for the Day.

This afternoon one of my co-workers took me to task for not bringing in pie on Pi(e) Day.

I did not know this was my job, but after years of periodically dropping off baked goods in the break rooms I've taken on the burden.

[Nope. The letter "i" standing alone, uncapitalized. -- Olso Xirgen, Duty Gnome]

"What helps the meat pie almost anything immensely is a splash of Tabasco."

Fixt.

(Or in the case of Schadenfreude Pie, a micropinch of cayenne.)

No wonder you're reasonably svelte and I'm not.

I have frequently claimed that there are five food groups and the fifth one is hot.

Hot food is something I came to as an adult; my parents couldn't handle anything hotter than Midwestern Bland. And my tolerance for heat has definitely increased with exposure, although I'm not at all interested in dicksizing contests over "who can eat the hottest stuff". It's a condiment, and like any other condiment can be overdone.

The pie was rather like eating a really good truffle with gingersnaps. A success.

I wish I was a good enough cook to duplicate the best pork chops I ever had, from a closed Seattle restaurant that was devoted to showing that UK cooking could be delicious. Two thick-cut pork chops, neither greasy nor dry, over a bed of steel-cut oatmeal, with just a drizzle of plum sauce. Wow.

It sounds a little bit like the dark chocolate & salted caramel tart my Amazing Girlfriend and I make pretty regularly... we might have to try an experimental version with cinnamon and pepper. I'm thinking it'll taste like our panforte nero more than the usual chocolate tart. This is not a bad thing.

Actually, enough for two pies. I figure I'll make two batches of filling, and freeze up one. Then I just need to drop it into a pie shell.

Dang, cloves and thyme are expensive. But I suppose it is good to have them around. (I discovered I have three half-full bottles of nutmeg. Go. Figure.)

(The suggestion about Tabasco was serious, BTW. I find that pie a bit bland, but Tabasco brings out the flavors marvelous-well.)

I will likely put it together tomorrow, and as is my custom I will photograph it.

Is that from Peri Charlifu or wossname? He's a regular exhibitor at conventions around Chicagoland, and IIRC I've heard testimony that the pie plates are good quality baking devices. He usually includes paragraphs of text with each piece, but if you wade through to the end there should be dishwasher safe/ oven safe info for you to confirm my claim.

Probably to late to help you, but there's always next con...

Also, if you can't grow thyme but can find an Indian/Pakistani/Middle Eastern grocery, try ajwain seeds. They look like caraway, taste like fresh thyme, and keep well.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-iqVyjOv8X0

Yes, that's why it works outside the mouth, where there aren't any taste receptors.

The other impressive 'works differently' spice is Sichuan peppercorns. That's a weird sensation.

Huh. I DO NOT HAVE ANY TABASCO! I'll remedy that before I go into pie mode.

If you see one of his pie plates again without the card, ask the art show staff; the cards may not have been put out (lack of room or whatever) but he will almost certainly have put them in the shipping boxes. They should be able to track them down for you.

Also when I've compared prices between the bulk section spices and the ones in glass jars (the market has a big aisle of those too) I keep finding that the jar costs $3.50 or more, which strikes me as excessive.

Madeleine posted a link to the recipe elsewhere. It's from Smitten Kitchen.

It's an open question in the lab as to what's stronger - the ghost chili flakes our adviser likes to add to everything, the couple of frightening hot sauces we've given him over the last couple years... or the weaponized vodka from two and a half years ago. If I polled the lab, I think the vote would be for the vodka. That stuff was evil. For that matter, it still it - it skulks in the lab freezer, dead yet dreaming.

Those peppers are sold as ornamentals because they're so high on the Scoville scale, which is why you have to process them so thoroughly. Also, wear disposable protective gloves when picking and handling them. They probably put your weaponized vodka to shame. OTOH, you might be able to use what's left of that for a similar purpose.

I'm afraid that chillies - all chillies, any chillies whatsoever - are to me rather as the works of James Joyce. I know many people enjoy them. I know that for many the appreciation of them are simply part of a developed and civilised taste. I am aware that for many, life would be less without them.

I just can't for the life of me understand why anyone would think that.

Except for a friend that doesn't use pepper "because it's too hot" but applies Wasabi paste by the teaspoonful. That one's just a bit odd, although it means that fewer folks accept bites off his/her plate at dinner, what with the chances between "bland" and "drink ALL the milk" being a crapshoot and all.

BTW, if you like to grow peppers or just admire their beauty and diversity, Jean Andrews' Peppers: The Domesticated Capsicums is an amazing book.

*for values of 'outbid' that include 'didn't actually bid because existing bids had already passed my maximum'

I haven't seen ornamental pepper plants in stores for a long time, or I'd get one.

I found out the other day, *after* I'd planted the spring pepper crop, that the ones I'd gotten (Alma Paprika) because the label said "mildly spicy" and they looked just like some that I'd been getting at the local farmers' market were known to be wildly variable in heat content. IOW, you never know what you're going to get with any individual pepper. I foresee an interesting summer, culinarily speaking.

Benjamin, #76: Thanks, but I think we'll pass. Reading your description of the "therapeutic dose" reminds me of something that happened to me a few months ago; we were having dinner at a Chinese restaurant, and I ordered kung pao chicken (one of my standard dishes). But the restaurant was one of those places that doesn't hold with actual light in the dining room, and as a result I managed to miss removing one of the little hot peppers, and got a well-distributed mouthful of capsaicin. That was an uncomfortable 3 or 4 minutes, and reminded me why I say there's a difference between "hot" and "incendiary"!

Some people experience endorphin release when they eat chiles. I'm pretty sure my husband is one of them. The sensations of physical irritation from eating chiles -- burning mouth, runny nose, teary eyes -- are for him strongly linked to a euphoric rush. He gets an uncontrollable big, relaxed grin on his face after he chomps into a hot pepper.

So it's not that he doesn't experience the pain and irritation. It's just that the unpleasantness of those sensations is overwhelmed by the immediate euphoric rush.

He's also found that ground cayenne pepper in capsule form is able to abort his ischemic cluster headaches. That may be more of an increased blood-flow thing than an endorphin thing, though. I don't know. But it works amazingly well for him.

Caroline at 86: I'd bet cash money that my adviser has a similar reaction (he doesn't have enough range of facial expression to confirm it, but the man goes through stupendous quantities of capsaisin-bearing condiments that he's got to be getting more than just heat out of the experience).

In addition, what you mentioned about your husband's self-medication with cayenne is intriguing. I don't know much about the neurochemistry or physiology involved, but it sounds like a plausible mechanism to me. The MRIer in me would love to see someone scanned with and without consuming it - if it is increasing blood flow, we'd see it in functional imaging (which measures blood oxygenation as a proxy for blood flow). Hm, wonder if we can get better data in fMRI with pre-scan administration of cayenne capsules...

I'd be fascinated to see MRI data.

I don't know much at all about the physiology of ischemic cluster headaches. I know he has to take the cayenne capsules at the very first sign of his prodrome, which is that his vision goes slightly out of focus. If he waits too long to take it, then the cayenne will have no effect and the sensation of being stabbed in the eye socket with an icepick will commence. But if he takes the cayenne early enough, then the prodrome symptoms will fade away and the headache won't materialize.

To me, this suggests that the capsaicin interrupts some kind of signaling process, and has to be introduced at the right point in that process in order to effectively interrupt it. I'm curious about what process that might be. The trouble with focusing his eyes suggests that the muscles in the area are involved somehow.

Perhaps I will do some reading and literature search.

Fade, this is good to know, because these peppers are in a corner of the garden box, so do not benefit from sprinkler overlap. I'll concentrate on giving them an extra watering.

TomB, these are seeds rather than a plant, if you're replying to me. Sold as food.

My assumption - which may well be wrong - is that there isn't a whole lot of hard physiological research on these headaches, since subjects who experience them would have to be willing to be examined during an episode. From what you've said, I can't imagine that, say, a long fMRI or other neuroimaging session is a desirable action during an episode. I'd bet, though, that parts of it can be pieced together from other research (e.g., visual disturbances are relatively well studied and understood, so that narrows down the domain).

I'm reminded - since I'm in a lab with a bunch of chili fiends - that pure capsaisin is a very bad idea. Surprisingly, it's readily available from specialty chemical supply houses... in milligram quantities, with emphatic warnings on neurotoxicity.

[Grad Student] This is pretty far afield from what I study (volitional eye movements), but now I'm wondering if there are any saccadic markers for these headaches - the usual rule with volitional eye movements is that they're extremely predictable; I wonder if the systemic perturbations manipulate that system. [/Grad Student]

The meat pie filling went together easily enough. But either pie shells in Oregon are undersized or onions and potatoes are oversized.

I shot for enough filling for two pies, but I have enough for three or four!

I just turned down the heat to 350 F on pie number one; I'm freezing the other two batches.

I took pictures. Start here in my Flickr set:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/stefan_e_jones/8566912084/in/set-72157629899209303

You have experience, which I lack, so I'll ask you if that makes any sense, or if the things I read were crap!

Flavor was good. The Tabasco helped.

It was likely short on meat. There was pork in every bite, but it was more a stew pie than a meat pie. I might fry up some sausages, or more ground pork, and mix it into the filling-batches currently in the fridge.

In general, activation of cranial sensory nerves (branching from the trigeminal nerve) is thought to cause cluster headache and migraine pain via the trigeminovascular reflex, which sets up a positive feedback loop causing pain. Essentially, the trigeminal nerve brings pain signals to the brainstem, which activates the parasympathetic system, which causes release of substances that further activate the trigeminal nerve, and round and round we go until something gets depleted enough to break the loop. [1,2]

(Incidentally, the sensory nerves affect the smooth muscle of the iris [3]. If the pupil on the affected side can't contract or dilate quite as well, that could account for the difficulty in focusing.)

Generally, activation of those nerves in cluster headache or migraine is associated with dilation of the cranial blood vessels. Some people think vasodilation actually causes the pain by pressing on pain-sensitive structures [4]. The classic family of medications used to abort migraines, triptans, are therefore specifically vasoconstrictors, not vasodilators.

Sensory nerve activation is thought to be mediated by a few different neuropeptides, among them calcitonin gene-related peptide (CGRP) and substance P. Current research on headache pain focuses on these signaling molecules [5].

For a while in the 1980s and 1990s there was a lot of excitement about substance P and capsaicin. There were some studies on intranasally-applied capsaicin for cluster headaches, with the hypothesis that capsaicin might cause the release of substance P from the sensory nerves, deplete substance P, and thus prevent the dysfunctional activation of the sensory nerves that causes cluster headache. But those studies were of daily, preventative use of capsaicin, not acute, abortive use [6].

These days, people seem to think that CGRP is a much more important signaling molecule in cluster headache and migraine [5,7,8]. As far as I can tell, capsaicin has the effect of causing CGRP release from sensory nerves (along with substance P release), but nobody seems to be really studying the use of capsaicin for cluster headaches or migraines anymore.

Also, I can't find anything at all on the effects of capsaicin ingestion on nociception. People have studied topical and intranasal use, and they use injected capsaicin to induce known pain and vasodilation responses, but nobody talks about what happens when you eat the stuff. Especially if you eat it so that it doesn't contact your mouth or nose on the way down (as with cayenne capsules).

If I had to guess at this point, I'd guess that swallowing cayenne capsules at the first sign of a cluster headache interrupts the dysfunctional activation of the cranial sensory nerves. I'd guess it might deplete one or more of the neuropeptides that activate the sensory nerves, breaking the pain loop pre-emptively. But those are very much just guesses. It could be a thousand other things that I know even less about than I know about this.

But it's darned interesting.

[1] Nesbitt A, Goadsby P. Cluster headache. BMJ. 2012; 344:e2407. doi: http://dx.doi.org/10.1136/bmj.e2407

[2] Drummond, PD. Mechanisms of autonomic disturbance in the face during and
between attacks of cluster headache. Cephalalgia. 2006 June; 26(6):633-641.

[3] Sicuteri F, Fanciullacci M, et al. Substance P theory: a unique focus on the painful and painless phenomena of cluster headache. Headache. 1990 Jan; 30(2):69-79 http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1689282

[4] May A, Bahra A, et al. PET and MRA findings in cluster headache and MRA in experimental pain. Neurology. 2000 Nov; 55(9):1328-1335. doi: http:/​/​dx.​doi.​org/​10.​1212/​WNL.​55.​9.​1328

[5] Edvinsson L. Sensory Nerves in Man and Their Role in Primary Headaches. Cephalalgia. 2001 Sept; 21(7):761-764. doi: 10.1111/j.1468-2982.2001.00245.x

[6] Marks DR, Rapoport A, et al. A double-blind placebo-controlled trial of intranasal capsaicin for cluster headache.
Cephalalgia. 1993 Apr;13(2):114-6. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8495452

[7] Edvinsson L, Goadsby P. Neuropeptides in headache. European Journal of Neurology.
1998; 5(4):329-341. doi: 10.1046/j.1468-1331.1998.540329.x

[8] Messlinger K, Fischer MJ, Lennerz JK. Neuropeptide effects in the trigeminal system: pathophysiology and clinical relevance in migraine. Keio J Med. 2011;60(3):82-9. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21979827

Modulating pupil size / interfering with iris control makes sense; it'll have a strong defocusing effect (manipulating the lens would as well, but that would be limited to near-field effects, mostly).

When fresh it's quite crumbly; letting it sit makes it more solid.

Are there more photos?

I'll take a photo of the final product tonight.

Though I don't get migraines or cluster headaches, I've taken cayenne capsules for headaches I suspected to be tension-related, and had it help. Once I got some relief from it after acetominophen, ibuprofen, caffeine, drinking water, and taking a nap had all failed to help. Can't promise that wasn't placebo effect (or just the headache going away on its own).

The major side effects reported in my household are digestive in nature: stabby/cramping stomach pain if capsules are taken on an empty stomach, and sometimes burning as everything … passes through, if you get my drift. Having some food on board when you take the capsule seems to reduce both. I'd steer clear if you have ulcers or acid reflux.

The capsules are generally 450 mg and labeled in "Heat Units" (which do not seem to be the same thing as Scoville units). As far as I can tell, 40,000 Heat Units means 0.25% capsaicin by weight. My husband takes a dose of 100,000 Heat Units. That amount gives me stomach pain even if I take it with food, so I stick to the 40,000 H.U. capsules.

Obviously, I'm not a doctor, and everyone should talk to their doctor before taking anything. These are just n=2 personal experiences.

Noise is funny, wrt headaches: I once left work early with one, had to wait for a train, and found that the idling diesel engines didn't bother me nearly as much as the bells on the trolleys passing through. I think it's because the engines are closer to white noise.

Or hurt, depending on whether your goal is milder or stronger peppers.

This led me to do some experimentation. I learned, for example, that while I actively dislike both green bell peppers and green jalapeños, I enjoy the ripe versions of both. (Ripe jalapeños are hard to find in supermarkets here, but our branch of Locally Grown has them in the summertime.)

Hot peppers nip migraines in the bud for me; this is handy because I pretty much only get them on incense exposure, and the only place I ever encounter incense is near where I buy most of my peppers. I'd rather skip the exposure altogether of course (and I usually manage to avoid it), but it's nice to have a cure close at hand if it comes up.

For my wife, peppers stop the headache part of a migraine but they don't make her feel fully functional.

Still, we make sure to have a jar of salsa in the fridge or cupboard at all times, just in case.

The stuff about potential mechanisms is interesting. I'd never had more than vague speculations to go on.

So, nng, welcome to Making Light. I am definitely not going to ask in you write poetry.

Pi(e) Day is completely universal, just as is pi. Do you have any favorite recipes?

(We don't agree, either, on the distinction between pies and tarts, but hey.)

Hot-pepper fans call this effect “the ring of fire”.