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      <title>Making Light :: Mormonism: The Gathering :: comments</title>
      <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/003834.html#comments </link>
      <description>Language, fraud, folly, truth, history, and knitting. Et cetera.</description>
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      <lastBuildDate>Fri, 17 Oct 2003 00:56:10 -0500</lastBuildDate>
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      <title>Mormonism: The Gathering</title>
      <description>Sample cards and everything:Urim and Thummim4: Take a piece of paper and crayons. Design your own card, using archaic pronouns...</description>
      <content:encoded>Sample cards and everything:Urim and Thummim4: Take a piece of paper and crayons. Design your own card, using archaic pronouns...</content:encoded>
      <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/003834.html</link>
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         <title>Mormonism: The Gathering -- comment #1 from Avram</title>
         <description>comment from Avram on 17.Oct.03</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://www.livejournal.com/users/agrumer/215857.html" rel="nofollow">I suggested one</a> that would actually be a plausible <i>Magic</i> card.  </p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted October 17, 2003 12:56 AM by Avram&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/003834.html#29790</link>
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         <pubDate>Fri, 17 Oct 2003 00:56:10 -0500</pubDate>
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         <title>Mormonism: The Gathering -- comment #2 from Tom Whitmore</title>
         <description>comment from Tom Whitmore on 17.Oct.03</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What's frightening about this is that most of the cards are actually playable, and not too unbalanced....</p>

<p>Took several tries to actually get through. You're challenging their bandwidth.</p>

<p>Cheers,<br />
Tom</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted October 17, 2003  2:05 AM by Tom Whitmore&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/003834.html#29792</link>
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         <pubDate>Fri, 17 Oct 2003 02:05:37 -0500</pubDate>
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         <title>Mormonism: The Gathering -- comment #3 from Kevin J. Maroney</title>
         <description>comment from Kevin J. Maroney on 17.Oct.03</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wow. I wonder how many people there are in the world who can get all of the jokes on that page. A lot of thought went into that. </p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted October 17, 2003  2:15 AM by Kevin J. Maroney&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/003834.html#29793</link>
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         <pubDate>Fri, 17 Oct 2003 02:15:26 -0500</pubDate>
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         <title>Mormonism: The Gathering -- comment #4 from Kevin Andrew Murphy</title>
         <description>comment from Kevin Andrew Murphy on 17.Oct.03</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I second Avram's suggestion of an extra card.</p>

<p>I'm also thinking of regular Magic cards I have that could be used to make a Mormon theme deck.  Naturals are the Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale and the Farelite Priest (who gets your white's whiter).</p>

<p>There should also be an instant card called "Convenient Revelation" that would allow you to change color, land or creature descriptors, sort of a combo of slight of mind and magical hack.  Likely something like three blue mana and you get to change one of each, or even remove them.</p>

<p>No, that's not "White and delightful!" it's "Pure and delightful!"</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted October 17, 2003  2:33 AM by Kevin Andrew Murphy&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/003834.html#29794</link>
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         <pubDate>Fri, 17 Oct 2003 02:33:19 -0500</pubDate>
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         <title>Mormonism: The Gathering -- comment #5 from Dylan O&apos;Donnell</title>
         <description>comment from Dylan O'Donnell on 17.Oct.03</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tangentially related, a variant of the boardgame "The Settlers of Catan" was recently published, called <a href="http://www.settlersofzarahemla.com/" rel="nofollow">The Settlers of Zarahemla</a>.</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted October 17, 2003 11:06 AM by Dylan O&apos;Donnell&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/003834.html#29820</link>
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         <pubDate>Fri, 17 Oct 2003 11:06:52 -0500</pubDate>
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         <title>Mormonism: The Gathering -- comment #6 from PiscusFiche</title>
         <description>comment from PiscusFiche on 17.Oct.03</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I was going to send you that, Teresa. Really. </p>

<p>My favourite is the one about the Holy Undergarments shielding you from Logic and Reason.</p>

<p>Avram: I like yours too. :)</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted October 17, 2003 11:23 AM by PiscusFiche&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/003834.html#29822</link>
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         <pubDate>Fri, 17 Oct 2003 11:23:32 -0500</pubDate>
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         <title>Mormonism: The Gathering -- comment #7 from PiscusFiche</title>
         <description>comment from PiscusFiche on 17.Oct.03</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Off-subject to Avram: Hey, I just noticed that you and I have some LJ friends in common, notably Faith (Smuu) of Demonology 101. Whacky. I love how small the internet seems at times. (And, hey, Teresa, you have a LJ account?) </p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted October 17, 2003 11:29 AM by PiscusFiche&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/003834.html#29826</link>
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         <pubDate>Fri, 17 Oct 2003 11:29:03 -0500</pubDate>
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         <title>Mormonism: The Gathering -- comment #8 from Eloise Mason</title>
         <description>comment from Eloise Mason on 17.Oct.03</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Looking at the Settlers website, it doesn't seem to have separate hexes, instead having three strips of hexes attached together. This will lower the replay value, methinks, as you don't get a fresh layout each time.</p>

<p>Also, they replaced 'sheep' with 'water' - I'm not sure if this changes what things cost to build. The 'knights' are 'stripling warriors,' and all the victory point cards are odd (i.e. not buildings, mostly).</p>

<p>They claim that soon you'll be able to read the rules on their website as a PDF.</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted October 17, 2003 12:02 PM by Eloise Mason&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/003834.html#29828</link>
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         <pubDate>Fri, 17 Oct 2003 12:02:16 -0500</pubDate>
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         <title>Mormonism: The Gathering -- comment #9 from LNHammer</title>
         <description>comment from LNHammer on 17.Oct.03</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I confess I don't get nearly as many of the jokes as I do in the <a href="http://flyingmoose.org/tolksarc/boardgame/lotrgame.htm" rel="nofollow">Lord of the Rings Board Game</a>.</p>

<p>---L.</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted October 17, 2003 12:33 PM by LNHammer&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/003834.html#29832</link>
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         <pubDate>Fri, 17 Oct 2003 12:33:06 -0500</pubDate>
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         <title>Mormonism: The Gathering -- comment #10 from Teresa Nielsen Hayden</title>
         <description>comment from Teresa Nielsen Hayden on 17.Oct.03</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Brilliant, Avram.</p>

<p>Elizabeth, what hit me hardest were the F.A.R.M.S. art and the tapir. This is seriously inside baseball, and I love it. </p>

<p>I'm surprised that none of them used the Deseret Alphabet, the Liahona, senines/senums/shiblons, or the Planet Kolob. And don't they need a United Order card that forces all the players to redistribute their cards evenly?</p>

<p>Kevin, I'd spec the Convenient Revelation card as allowing you to change one word. That'll encourage ingenuity.</p>

<p>Eloise, I theorize that the victory points are odd because they're tied to the values of Nephite currency.</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted October 17, 2003  1:36 PM by Teresa Nielsen Hayden&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/003834.html#29842</link>
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         <pubDate>Fri, 17 Oct 2003 13:36:03 -0500</pubDate>
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         <title>Mormonism: The Gathering -- comment #11 from Teresa Nielsen Hayden</title>
         <description>comment from Teresa Nielsen Hayden on 17.Oct.03</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Here's <a href="http://www.jefflindsay.com/LDSFAQ/FQ_BMProb2.shtml" rel="nofollow">one way</a> to understand F.A.R.M.S., and the Pre-Columbian horse that looks just like a tapir.</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted October 17, 2003  1:47 PM by Teresa Nielsen Hayden&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/003834.html#29845</link>
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         <pubDate>Fri, 17 Oct 2003 13:47:10 -0500</pubDate>
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         <title>Mormonism: The Gathering -- comment #12 from PiscusFiche</title>
         <description>comment from PiscusFiche on 17.Oct.03</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>T: The guy who made them is thinking about making some new cards based on the suggestions in this thread. (I poked him earlier and showed him your link.)</p>

<p>Ugh. The FARMS rationalisations about language make my head hurt. I guess Occam's razor only applies when it's useful to their cause. This also doesn't explain words like "rameuptom" where clearly a word and a concept we didn't have in the Old World exist in terms of BoM.</p>

<p>(Ditto for "Curelom".) </p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted October 17, 2003  2:01 PM by PiscusFiche&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/003834.html#29846</link>
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         <pubDate>Fri, 17 Oct 2003 14:01:23 -0500</pubDate>
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         <title>Mormonism: The Gathering -- comment #13 from Jon Meltzer</title>
         <description>comment from Jon Meltzer on 17.Oct.03</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The site is slashdotted. Who knew Teresa has such a large audience :-)</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted October 17, 2003  2:10 PM by Jon Meltzer&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/003834.html#29848</link>
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         <pubDate>Fri, 17 Oct 2003 14:10:52 -0500</pubDate>
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         <title>Mormonism: The Gathering -- comment #14 from Teresa Nielsen Hayden</title>
         <description>comment from Teresa Nielsen Hayden on 17.Oct.03</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I was just about to mention the curelom. Somebody ought to use that word to name a new animal.</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted October 17, 2003  2:27 PM by Teresa Nielsen Hayden&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/003834.html#29849</link>
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         <pubDate>Fri, 17 Oct 2003 14:27:05 -0500</pubDate>
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         <title>Mormonism: The Gathering -- comment #15 from Kevin Andrew Murphy</title>
         <description>comment from Kevin Andrew Murphy on 17.Oct.03</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Teresa,</p>

<p>You're right.  One word:</p>

<p>Convenient Revelation<br />
Instant<br />
Blue/White</p>

<p>Change one word of text in any card.</p>

<p>"That's not 'White and delightful!' it's 'Pure and delightful!'"</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted October 17, 2003  2:29 PM by Kevin Andrew Murphy&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/003834.html#29850</link>
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         <pubDate>Fri, 17 Oct 2003 14:29:25 -0500</pubDate>
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         <title>Mormonism: The Gathering -- comment #16 from Teresa Nielsen Hayden</title>
         <description>comment from Teresa Nielsen Hayden on 17.Oct.03</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And now, from the <a href="http://www.latterdaylampoon.com/gazelem/apologetics/" rel="nofollow">Latter-Day Lampoon</a>:</p>

<p><i><b>Tapir-Back Riders</b><br />
Tune: "Paperback Writer"</i></p>

<p>Dear Sir or Madam will you read my book? <br />
It took me years to write, will you take a look?<br />
It's based on a novel by a man named Joe<br />
And the main idea is the Lamanites were<br />
Tapir-back riders<br />
Tapir-back riders</p>

<p>See, the Nephites came to the promised land<br />
And those damn exmos just don't understand<br />
That when they said "horse" they meant something else<br />
But it all makes sense if you know that they were<br />
Tapir-back riders<br />
Tapir-back riders</p>

<p>I know the whole thing doesn't hold up well<br />
If you take it literally, but what the hell<br />
There&#8217;s this group of guys that work at FARMS<br />
And they can save the whole thing by postulating <br />
Tapir-back riders<br />
Tapir-back riders ...</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted October 17, 2003  2:45 PM by Teresa Nielsen Hayden&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/003834.html#29853</link>
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         <pubDate>Fri, 17 Oct 2003 14:45:41 -0500</pubDate>
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         <title>Mormonism: The Gathering -- comment #17 from Eloise Mason</title>
         <description>comment from Eloise Mason on 17.Oct.03</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>*laugh until I squeak*</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted October 17, 2003  2:49 PM by Eloise Mason&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/003834.html#29855</link>
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         <pubDate>Fri, 17 Oct 2003 14:49:33 -0500</pubDate>
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         <title>Mormonism: The Gathering -- comment #18 from Kevin Andrew Murphy</title>
         <description>comment from Kevin Andrew Murphy on 17.Oct.03</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You know, fantasy novels have come up with all sorts of whacky things to ride, but tapirs are hardly one of them.</p>

<p>I decided to see if I could find any pictures of a "riding tapir."  This is what I found:</p>

<p>http://elfwood.lysator.liu.se/loth/u/r/ursula/tribaltapir.jpg.html</p>

<p>I guess when JS meant something else by "horse" he also meant something else by "riding."</p>

<p>Another Convenient Revelation....</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted October 17, 2003  3:38 PM by Kevin Andrew Murphy&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/003834.html#29857</link>
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         <pubDate>Fri, 17 Oct 2003 15:38:19 -0500</pubDate>
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         <title>Mormonism: The Gathering -- comment #19 from Adrian</title>
         <description>comment from Adrian on 17.Oct.03</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Kevin,</p>

<p>Riding a tapir (in either sense of "riding") would seem to have very little to do with convenience.  Does this game have formal<br />
disadvantages, like Champions or GURPS?  So you could draw "Inconvenient Revelation?"</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted October 17, 2003  3:45 PM by Adrian&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/003834.html#29858</link>
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         <pubDate>Fri, 17 Oct 2003 15:45:20 -0500</pubDate>
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         <title>Mormonism: The Gathering -- comment #20 from Adrian</title>
         <description>comment from Adrian on 17.Oct.03</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Kevin,</p>

<p>Riding a tapir (in either sense of "riding") would seem to have very little to do with convenience.  Does this game have formal<br />
disadvantages, like Champions or GURPS?  So you could draw "Inconvenient Revelation?"</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted October 17, 2003  3:45 PM by Adrian&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/003834.html#29859</link>
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         <pubDate>Fri, 17 Oct 2003 15:45:24 -0500</pubDate>
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         <title>Mormonism: The Gathering -- comment #21 from Skwid</title>
         <description>comment from Skwid on 17.Oct.03</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yo!  Work un-safe warning would be nice!</p>

<p>Yiminy...</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted October 17, 2003  3:47 PM by Skwid&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/003834.html#29860</link>
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         <pubDate>Fri, 17 Oct 2003 15:47:51 -0500</pubDate>
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         <title>Mormonism: The Gathering -- comment #22 from Kevin Andrew Murphy</title>
         <description>comment from Kevin Andrew Murphy on 17.Oct.03</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And here's everything you ever wanted to know about <a href="http://www.exmormon.org/mormon/mormon053.htm" rel="nofollow">the curelom,</a> including a poem.</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted October 17, 2003  3:48 PM by Kevin Andrew Murphy&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/003834.html#29861</link>
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         <pubDate>Fri, 17 Oct 2003 15:48:11 -0500</pubDate>
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         <title>Mormonism: The Gathering -- comment #23 from Stefan Jones</title>
         <description>comment from Stefan Jones on 17.Oct.03</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Curelom (tm): Dow Chemicals' exciting new artificial leather.</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted October 17, 2003  4:00 PM by Stefan Jones&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/003834.html#29862</link>
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         <pubDate>Fri, 17 Oct 2003 16:00:24 -0500</pubDate>
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         <title>Mormonism: The Gathering -- comment #24 from Eloise Mason</title>
         <description>comment from Eloise Mason on 20.Oct.03</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So now we can add cureloms to the poor oppressed naugas when we picket?</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted October 20, 2003  9:10 AM by Eloise Mason&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/003834.html#30115</link>
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         <pubDate>Mon, 20 Oct 2003 09:10:36 -0500</pubDate>
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         <title>Mormonism: The Gathering -- comment #25 from Bill Shunn</title>
         <description>comment from Bill Shunn on 27.Oct.03</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>"Tapir-Back Rider" is brilliant, and sounds suspiciously like the work of an SF fan and exmo who used to contribute parody lyrics to my web site.  For instance, this tune, "<a href="http://www.shunn.net/mormon/cabaret/smith04.html" rel="nofollow">The Famous Dr. Hugh</a>."</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted October 27, 2003  3:01 PM by Bill Shunn&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/003834.html#30761</link>
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         <pubDate>Mon, 27 Oct 2003 15:01:11 -0500</pubDate>
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